The Altered Scrolls: IPISYDHT #4 Roundup

By Rutskarn Posted Saturday Nov 7, 2015

Filed under: Elder Scrolls 30 comments

Because of anticipated burnout, wrist aches, and the unusually large volume of questions, I’ve set aside this Saturday to post my answers to as many of your queries as possible. We’ll probably start with Skyrim next week.

Da Mage asks: Considering Oblivion's other guild storylines, do you feel the more action-adventure MQ that they went with was the right choice over the proposed politics storyline?

The sluggishness of conveying complex topics through slow, deliberate voice acting, the orientation of Oblivion towards fast-paced adventure rather than ideological intrigue, and the overall amicably goofy tone its art style and physics convey meant that it was a very good idea to stick with a nice neat fantasy plot rather than a sprawling drama on the order of Daggerfall.

Note that even Skyrim‘s clash-of-ideologies storyline is told mostly through scripted visuals and in-universe components: things like Stormcloak patrols and public executions do most of the work of conveying that a civil war is going on intractably in the background.

Grey Cap asks: Do you think that the switch (from Morrowind) to a bland, standard fantasy skin was necessary for the franchise's growth? Or could the developers have kept the weird and allowed the new style of gameplay and storytelling to carry the sales?

That’s a really tough question, one I’ve heard asked many times before–one that’s inevitably loaded with the biases of the responder. So here’s my biased response: yes, the game had to migrate to a broad approachable fantasy setting to reach mass appeal. Morrowind‘s style of alien transport was very good at getting a medium-sized devoted audience, the sort who would generate the day-one sales that allow for Oblivionesque productions in the first place…but the problem with the truly alien is that it alienates. By its definition, it drives away potential sales. It’s totally survivable to market a niche product to an eager and devoted fringe, but that does not represent the kind of franchise growth Bethesda clearly wanted.

Maybe nobody anywhere is as crazy about Cyrodiil as some of us are about Vvardenfel. So what? They’re only trying to make us buy each game once. When Skyrim came out and it was grey snow and grey snow zombies I grumbled, I pined, I bought the videogame. “Somewhat boring” is rarely a dealbreaker in AAA videogames.

Neko asks: What did you think of Shivering Isles?

The original game’s dungeons are linear corridors scattered with twenty versions of the same obnoxiously tough boringly-themed monsters. The area added by Shivering Isles is a beautiful, creative, and vibrant world populated by linear corridors full of the same obnoxiously tough interestingly-themed monsters. It’s cool, but it’s not fun.

Henson asks: What's your opinion of the switch from a keyword-based dialogue system to a system where your PC's dialogue is fully written, given how these systems work in an ‘Elder Scrolls' game? Would certain changes have to be made to the ‘Elder Scrolls' formula to make one or the other approach more viable?

Pretend you’re a voice actor, go back, and try to read all of an NPC’s topic responses from Morrowind aloud and dramatically. You will suddenly realize a.) that there’s a lot of really redundant information that sounds stilted and stupid when read aloud over and over, b.) that the amount of information being conveyed verbally really slows down the pace of whatever you’re doing, and c.) what had felt sort of like a conversation when you were abstractly digesting information now feels like you’re touring a museum with a malfunctioning headset. It’s a literary approach: it works to get the largest chunks of data into your characters’ head as possible, it stinks for moment-to-moment drama facilitated by voice acting. What changed between games to make this switchover necessary? Basically everything.

Kikito asks: What is your opinion on the “portals to the daedra dimension” (or whatever they were called)? I personally found them a bit repetitive and boring, but the loot they provided was too good to pass.

I resented that because enchanting is now solely the purview of the Mage’s Guild, and prohibited unless you a.) do a bunch of potentially tedious quests or b.) know how to glitch your way through the gate (which I did), Oblivion Gates are the only way to get enchanted weapons. It’s one of the few times the game really twists your arm about doing content. You need enchanted weapons. It knows exactly what it’s doing by making you literally jump through flaming hoops to get them.

The sole redeeming quality of the run through lots of Oblivion Gates schtick is that it was presumably easy on the developers. From a player perspective it’s annoying and repetitive.

Kaljtgg asks: How much did you mod the various games and did you feel that once you did, the game improved in a significant way?

I never modded the games until Skyrim. That was the first game where I felt like there was some genius level of gameplay hiding just below the surface, waiting for the touch of a sufficiently-gifted modder to bring it forward–stuff like hunger/thirst, cold weather exposure, big bright colors–stuff that felt like it honestly should have been in the basic game, stuff that could be implemented skillfully without any ugly and obvious hacks. The biggest mods for Morrowind and Oblivion had a kind of fanfiction quality to them, a sense that their game is not my game and we should probably keep it that way.

Mersadeon asks: What is your opinion on the introduction of pregenerated traps in Oblivion?

I feel like there’s two implied questions here. What did they add? They added a novel showcase of the physics engine, a level of variety to the very repetitive dungeons, and tools for generating scenes and emergent scenarios with NPCs and monsters. Could the resources needed to make them have been spent better? Honestly, probably not. They needed something to spice up dungeons and given the materials they had to work with, this was the most parsimonious and practical solution.

Tzeneth asks: What was your favorite quest in Oblivion? Whether you take that as to complete or to examine or story wise is up to you.

It says a lot that this is a genuinely hard question, because I can’t really say that about any of the other games. I’m going to tentatively say Sheogorath’s quest where you trick a town into thinking the world’s ending. It’s funny, it’s devoid of combat, and it has a neat reward.

Decius asks: Across The Elder Scrolls games, the quest rewards don't include ‘experience', since the leveling mechanic doesn't use that concept. How do you think that changes the quest design and incentives to complete quests, and in what ways are those changes notable to the design space and play space?

I think the fact that you don’t get a direct pat on the head for cashing in a quest is a huge part of why the Elder Scrolls games are the kings of single-player open world titles: they show conspicuous respect for the player’s time. In any game where quests give XP for completion, you are inevitably going to end up doing something you don’t really give a shit about so you can cash in and level up faster. You’re trapped between your desire to play in the most optimally fun and productive ways and your inability to reconcile those will make them both less appealing. To put it another way: the satisfying thing to do is the thing that is both smart and enjoyable. If you have to choose, you won’t be satisfied.

That’s so rarely a problem in Elder Scrolls titles. If somebody tells me to go collect a dozen mushrooms, I know the main reward of that is going to be that I have collected a dozen mushrooms. If I feel like rounding up fungi there’s just enough incentive to reward my labors; if I don’t, I’ll probably be okay. It’s hard to go back to MMOs after tasting that.

SoranMBane asks: An inordinate number of Elder Scrolls players never bother to finish (or sometimes even touch) the main questlines of these games (for example, only 28% of Skyrim players on Steam have the achievement for beating the main questline). Why do you think that is, exactly?

Most players don’t finish most games, and in Elder Scrolls games “completion” is presented nebulously and lukewarmly enough that I’m surprised even 28% of customers:

  • Install the game
  • Start the game
  • Decide to keep playing the game past the intro
  • Remember that the main quest is a thing/distinguish it from all the other storylines presented
  • Pursue it all the way through, ignoring other distractions
  • Do so while signed in or otherwise able to record an achievement (I know I lack badges for about a hundred of my own gaming accomplishments)

James asked: Is the Dark Brotherhood quest in oblivion set in the manor house (i think its called summerhome) perhaps the single best quest Bethesda have ever made?

It’s a perfect Bethesda quest. It’s a clever idea, you don’t have to think about it too hard, and it’s so much fun you don’t notice it’s completely broken.


From The Archives:

30 thoughts on “The Altered Scrolls: IPISYDHT #4 Roundup

  1. Scholar Beardpig says:

    These are all excellent questions, and I look forward to reading your thoughts on Skyrim and maybe even ESO!

  2. evileeyore says:

    I’d like to address one of the questions, it’s one I’ve heard a few times and I think it inherents overlooks something about the franchise…

    Grey Cap asks: “Do you think that the switch (from Morrowind) to a bland, standard fantasy skin was necessary for the franchise's growth? Or could the developers have kept the weird and allowed the new style of gameplay and storytelling to carry the sales?”

    You’re completely ignoring that Morrowind was a dramatic shift from bog standard fantasy to an alien fantasy world. A return to the previous setting style isn’t a shift in the series, it was a return to form after an experimental departure.

    1. Grey Cap says:

      I’ve never played or been at all interested in the games before Morrowind, so I think that in my head Morrowind simply becomes “the Elder Scrolls’ History”.

      Although I suppose what I was really subconsciously asking was “can I hold out hope for a more colourful Elder Scrolls 6”, even though I know that of course I can’t.

      1. Incunabulum says:

        While I’m ambivalent about the possibility, we can always hope for the Khajit or Argonian lands in TES VI. Personally, I’d prefer the Khajit – I’m not interested in wandering around a swamp.

        1. Daemian Lucifer says:

          So you would rather explore elsewhere?

          1. evileeyore says:

            Why yes, I’d love to see what Elsweyr looked like.

            1. Daemian Lucifer says:

              Ok.Which place in the elder scrolls universe would you like to see?

  3. Da Mage says:

    I didn’t want to give an opinion when I asked my question before, but I completely agree. Oblivion’s strengths would not have gelled well with a dialogue heavy and intrigue questline. Daggerfall and Morrowind did it ‘fairly’ well, but their combat was almost non-existent, so it would have not been good for them to have action-quests.

    Glad you share the same opinion.

  4. Rack says:

    I had the weirdest bug in Whodunnit in that I genuinely had nothing to do with killing the most of the guests. For some reason they all ended up killing each other without my involvement beyond killing the final murderer.

  5. el_b says:

    you should get a speech to text to help ease the strain off your wrist. severe rsi is hell, trust me. i can only type a few sentences at best after 5 years of being in constant pain. took years for doctors to stop forcing pills down my throat and send me to physiotherapists. i recommend dragon naturally speaking.

    1. Raygereio says:

      PSA time!
      – When using your keyboard & mouse, make sure your wrist is positioned and supported properly.
      – Have a good chair that you can sit in comfortably and that supports you. And don’t slouch![/momvoice]
      – Take regular breaks where you stretch for just a few moments. Yes, even during gaming sessions.

      Remember: Once you start having pains that don’t go away with a good stretch, chances are it’s too late. As el_b said: severe RSI is hell. It’s better to prevent it.

      And get up and take some exercise. And go eat your veggies!

      1. Other activities that exercise the hands and wrists in various ways are also good (says the woman who’s genetically just a bit too flexible and thus prone to stressing ligaments and arthritis). I knit, but there’s a lot of various activities that are not pressing buttons in various ways that help.

        And yeah, once the damage is done, it’s done. Managed to give myself Gamekeeper’s Thumb in both hands, still can’t use controllers for any length of time (10+ years later, damn you college pokemon habit!)

        Edited for other suggestions, because I know way too much about pain…
        Switching up input modes is helpful, even if it’s going from a slanted keyboard to a flat one or laptop to desktop. I alternate mouse, trackball, and touchpad too, depending on what’s not happy.
        They make heating pad things for wrists, which I love, and might help. Also, there are lidocaine patchs (doc script required) which are good if you MUST do something (but temporarily numbing can obviously lead to further injury if you push so be really careful). The same caveat applies to pain meds. They’re great, I use ’em for chronic and (pretty damn disabling at times) abdominal pain and yeah, they give me a chance to get out and about and not just hide in bed crying. But it is again, quite easy, to injure yourself further while on ’em because you don’t feel the hurt (might have done this myself with a knitting binge earlier this year).
        Physical therapy can be a huge help (if financially possible) as can occupational therapy (I think that’s the name, they help you find new and not so ow ways to do stuff, some pts can do it too).
        Best of luck and hugs! I know how frustrating hand/wrist stuff can be (ended up having to take my finals orally one year because I couldn’t type or write due to the aforementioned gamekeeper’s thumb).

  6. Spammy says:

    I know this is sacrilege for a PC gamer, but I also don’t use many mods for pretty much exactly the reason you described. Most major mods that aren’t total conversions feel like someone’s fanfic or feels to me in some way that they’re putting down the original game to make their mod look better. The only game that I’ve ever really modded is Kerbal Space Program, and I only used four mods. Three gave me more information (Flight Engineer, Alarm Clock, Docking UI) and the last did close to what you said, felt like it was unlocking a potential just below the surface (Station Science Mod).

    1. Daemian Lucifer says:

      I feel like that for many games as well.The exception are games that have a (good) editor in them.I never had a problem with mods for civs 2 and 3,because if I didnt like something,I could change it myself,I didnt need to hunt for that one single perfect mod.

    2. Raygereio says:

      Most major mods that aren't total conversions feel like someone's fanfic

      I honestly don’t get what you and Rutskarn are trying to say with that.
      Yeah, mods are fanfic’esque in nature. That’s the whole point of mods: You make changes to the game to suit your personal tastes. To make it more fun and enjoyable for you.

      Rutskarn mentioned some stuff he liked in Skyrim:

      stuff like hunger/thirst, cold weather exposure, big bright colors”“stuff that felt like it honestly should have been in the basic game

      I completely disagree with that.
      For starters no Skyrim mods have implemented that skillfully without ugly and obvious hacks. But more importantly, I don’t think any of that should have been in the basic game. Hunger/thirst is exceedingly difficult to balance properly and either becomes annoying or meaningless busywork. Same with cold weather exposure. And I don’t think I’ve seen a brighter-colours-graphical overhaul that didn’t make the game look like an oversaturated mess and made me think whoever designed has a faulty monitor.
      So, I don’t think any of that should be in my game. My modded setup – or fanfic if we’re really going to call it – doesn’t include that. But Rutskarn is free to include all that stuff in his game. Like I said: That’s the whole point of mods. To make it more fun for you personally.

      Also I think a lot of people forget that it’s okay to mod the mods. I’ve often seen people go “Gee, I really like 99% of what this mod does, but I don’t like this one tiny detail. *sigh* I guess I’ll won’t use it.” My response to that is always: “Why not grab that mod, remove that one thing you don’t like and have fun? It’s not like modding is hard. I mean, I can do it.”

      1. Daemian Lucifer says:

        Depending on the game,it can be hard.You have to dedicate a few hours in order to get the tools and learn how to use them,and thats often really not worth it.The exception are games that have built in editors,and even those are often very clunky/not sufficient enough.

        1. Raygereio says:

          You have to dedicate a few hours in order to get the tools and learn how to use them,and thats often really not worth it.

          And that’s the part where you lost me. I don’t get that.
          if you take the time to learn how to use the tools and how to mod the game, you can have the potential to make the game more fun for you. How is that not worth it? Or to look at it from a cost-benefit point of view. There are plenty of games that I would have played but once, or maybe not finished playing at all, if I could not have modded them. The investment of time required to learn how to mod a game paid it back in a lot more time having fun playing the modified game.
          Then again I take enjoyment from the act of modding. I think it’s fun to have an idea for something and then try to see how I can fit it into a game’s mechanics and limitations. So maybe there’s a fundamental disconnect going here.

          But even if you just want to be a mod-user I think that attitude is still problematic. In my experience the number one cause of people running into problems when using mods, is not having bothered to read the readme because it supposedly would have taken too long or because reading is boring. When in fact it would have taken but a few moments and probably would have saved that user hours of troubleshooting his problem.

          1. Daemian Lucifer says:

            if you take the time to learn how to use the tools and how to mod the game, you can have the potential to make the game more fun for you. How is that not worth it?

            Because having the potential to do THING is not the same thing as actually doing THING.And I can spend that time playing something that already is fun.

            Not to mention that there are plenty of small things that can be in that 1% thats bugging you.It could be words,it could be font,it could be character models,it could be code,it could be anything.So not only will you spend hours learning how to fix that specific thing in a specific game(because most games have modding tools that are worth jack for another game),it may very well turn out that youve learned something that will help you only with that specific mod and not the X others you also have only 1% problem with.

            If its modding itself that you find fun,then you dont have a problem because you already will know how to mod the game before even finding a mod that you have only 1% problem with.Heck,Ive been modding civ2 loooooong before Ive even attempted to try out someone elses mod.

      2. Blue_Pie_Ninja says:

        For Oblivion, the only mod I recommend to anyone is the Oblivion Character Overhaul as it really improves the game by removing the potato heads and replacing them with better heads. The only problem would be the Dark Elves as they have what looks like tattoos on their face, but it isn’t that bad. But seriously, it completely changes the feel of the game just by changing the NPCs heads.

  7. Merlin says:

    they show conspicuous respect for the player's time

    I’m far from a Bethesda enthusiast – my experience is limited to a couple hours of Morrowind and a single playthrough of Fallout 3 – but as far as I’ve been able to tell, the company’s success has come entirely from them not giving the slightest crap about their players’ time. Quest writing is perpetually half-assed, the game systems range from obviously-totally-broken to subtly-totally-broken, and the worlds are sprawling and filled with Yet Another Bandit Cave/Oblivion Gate/Subway Section/Etc. They patch things together well enough to make your lizard brain keep clicking the mouse, but “thousands of hours of filler for you to Progress Quest away at” is not what I would call respect for the player’s time.

    I mean, let’s pull up some of your own quotes from earlier in the series.

    There are many towns. But pretty much every town in the game looks the same, literally every store and guild of a type has an almost identical interior with absolutely identical shopkeepers, and the houses are all impoverished, procedurally generated, and not worth bothering with.

    Northmoor is bigger than most modern games ever set out to be. In my entire main-quest playthrough, I don't think I ever set foot in it. After all, the game has about forty other provinces and shockingly close to a million NPCs, almost none of whom are important or memorable.

    So big that the guy so obsessed with Daggerfall he wrote a guide that remains definitive to this day put “smaller dungeons” at the top of his wish list for the sequel. Inconveniently large dungeons. Obnoxiously large, labyrinthine, three-dimensional dungeons full of secret passages and strange fixtures and dungeon ecosystems. Fun anecdote: on my first playthrough, I accepted a quest to go to a dungeon and kill a certain amount of orcs. I was in that dungeon for three out-of-game weeks, countless real-world hours, discovering new rooms and levels all the time, and I didn't even get to the part with the orcs.

    Which, I'm not really asking for Northmoor to be interesting. But there's not a whole lot of reason for it to be there if it isn't and frankly, it'd be nice if somewhere was.

    That’s all Arena & Daggerfall comments, but in Morrowind, even simply leveling up involves the game incentivizing you to spend an hour jumping in place or swimming back and forth in a pond. To say nothing of the game’s total lack of quest tracking and ability to talk to anyone about anything in the game’s glossary. If you didn’t go in planning to spend a bunch of extra time taking your own notes, you were doomed to spend your stabbing bandits, fleeing from cliff racers, and never actually accomplishing a thing.

    I don’t deny that there are virtues to Bethesda’s approach to game design (even as it’s shifted over the years), and it’s been interesting to see a long-time fan pick and probe at them. But you’re way out in left field on this one.

    1. Running to Mars says:

      I agree wholeheartedly with this. I feel like the only reason Bethesda are the “kings of single-player open world games” is because of a lack of competition. We just need more New Vegas and Witcher 3 type games.

      1. Bitterpark says:

        Which aren’t exactly trivial to make. I’d say their main competition in that genre is “The Ubisoft Sandbox Game”, and Bethesda is (probably) winning that race, because, for all their inumerable faults, they actually put the time in to develop proper sequels, instead of reskinning the same game every year.

      2. Sartharina says:

        But will those games let me play as a naked Demon-killing catgirl?

    2. Blue_Pie_Ninja says:

      I guess the whole lost in a world thing is what lots of Bethesda fans like about the games, just living in the worlds is enough of a reward, instead of the incentivised “go here and kill / grab X to obtain reward Y now you have finished the game, good for you” style that most other games go for.

  8. Darren says:

    I’m going to ask a question again, just because I think it’s a point you should at least touch on in passing: does Fallout have a place in your series-wide Elder Scrolls evaluation? Sure, the first two games have nothing to do with the Elder Scrolls, but Fallout 3–besides being structured much more like an Elder Scrolls title than a Fallout title–features several ideas that seemed to exist in response to criticisms of Oblivion, and which were then polished and carried into Skyrim, with enemy scaling being a pretty obvious one. It seems like some consideration should be given to Bethesda’s other major franchise given how similar they have become.

    1. BenD says:

      What blew my mind the most about Oblivion was all the assets I recognized from Fallout 3. And how they’d managed to use those assets in a way that didn’t result in a gray-green mess of mud.

  9. Artur CalDazar says:

    Reading your answer to the Shivering Isles question reminded of of watching you stream it. You were not having fun at all.

  10. Ant says:

    Beware of taking the steam number too seriously. If you don’t have a good connection, you won’t get most achievement even if you complete the game

  11. manofsteles says:

    “…the satisfying thing to do is the thing that is both smart and enjoyable. If you have to choose, you won't be satisfied.”

    It seems that that’s why the Thieve’s Guild, Fighter’s Guild, and Dark Brotherhood quests stuck out so much compared to the rest of the quests (especially the main quest). While the rewards that come with rising to Guildmaster were not insignificant, those questlines seemed so much more rewarding because they were designed in interesting ways, and the experience of completing them seemed to be most of the reward.

  12. Vivi says:

    I don’t get the criticism of “mods are fanfic” either. The point of (good) fanfic is to give the fandom more of what they liked about the original content, or to give more depth to the worldbuilding / characterization. Usually, a widely accepted fanon-version of the direction in which to improve / extend the existing content quickly crystalizes, which fits many people’s tastes. (Things that aren’t majority compatible get ignored and not copied by other authors.)

    In the context of, say, Morrowind, that means that when I’ve done every quest that interested me at least 2 or 3 times, but still want to keep wasting time in this particular setting / game engine, then I go looking for a big, fanfic-y quest expansion mod. Some don’t really bother to fit their storyline in the existing worldbuilding, but those normally are the small, amateurish mods which just add a wish-fullfilment romance companion or something like that. The ambitious mods that have whole teams working on them either work like a completely new game that just uses the same engine kind of like a DM uses an existing RPG system to tell a new adventure (like The Wizard’s Islands and most other new landmass mods) – which is perfectly fine with me. Or they’re written by people who are deeply interested in the lore and who are absolutely perfectionist about making the new quests feel “authentic”. In fact, I find these fanfic quest mods generally better written (or at least more interesting) than the original, even if they have a few bugs. (The quests in the original game have to be dumbed down somewhat to give kid players a chance to follow the plot, and they’re mostly designed by writers whose day job it is to create filler content for someone else’s grand vision, which then has to pass the tastes of a bunch of random testers and executives. A fan modder on the other hand designs with a free hand, no dead-line and the true passion of the kind of person willing to invest hundreds of hours with no reward beyond praise from the players who happen to share the modder’s particular tastes.) For Morrowind, mods like Pax Redoran, Rise of House Telvanni, Tamriel Rebuilt (on a huge new landmass) and Nevena’s Twin Lamps & Slave Hunters (2 new factions, though only the Twin Lamps have much of a storyline) are such lore-integrated quest mods.

    As for mods that just change game mechanics or looks, I don’t understand how anyone can think stuff like Better Bodies/Heads/Beasts/Clothes, Better Dialog Font (to make it readable on higher resolutions), Rational Wildlife (sets most healthy animals on “non-aggressive” – including cliffracers), Weathered Signs (puts the names of towns visibly on the way signs) or the Morrowing FPS Optimizer are in any way optional for pleasant gameplay. Or simply small fixes for stuff the developers never fixed, like Voiced Vivec & Yakety Yagrum (makes Vivec and Yagrum actually use all the voice acting files that exist for them in the game).
    We can talk about the usefulness of things like Children of Morrowind (just adds kids to the towns), the various Less Generic NPC mods (add characterization to the NPCs of the main quest and some towns by rewriting their generic dialogue with individualized answers, as well as adding many small quests), Ashlander Traders (adds a neat little trade caravan that can take you to the Ashlander camps from the main towns), or the Morrowind Code Patch program (adds a lot of new coding options for modders to use, an optional rebalancing of the item enchanting system that makes them less game-breakingly overpowered, and some GUI changes; also fixes bugs that the developers never bothered to fix, including one that corrupts savegames, though I had played the game without problems for years without the program), Morrowind Comes Alive (adds lots more generic non-quest NPCs to the world and makes them appear and disappear randomly from taverns, shops, etc., to make the world feel less static – so many in fact that it doesn’t run on my old PC) or the various texture overhaul sets and Graphic Extender programs.

Thanks for joining the discussion. Be nice, don't post angry, and enjoy yourself. This is supposed to be fun. Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked*

You can enclose spoilers in <strike> tags like so:
<strike>Darth Vader is Luke's father!</strike>

You can make things italics like this:
Can you imagine having Darth Vader as your <i>father</i>?

You can make things bold like this:
I'm <b>very</b> glad Darth Vader isn't my father.

You can make links like this:
I'm reading about <a href="">Darth Vader</a> on Wikipedia!

You can quote someone like this:
Darth Vader said <blockquote>Luke, I am your father.</blockquote>

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published.