T w e n t y S i d e d
- Use an NPC to nudge the players in the right direction.
- Give the players hints out-of-character.
- Allow them to do the stupid thing, then laugh at them later.
- Find smarter players.
Edit:
Two years ago me and my siblings made the decision to remove a slur from the comic during the remastering process. We had a lot of talks, and went back and forth for a while over several weeks. We brought it up to the community, which was divided on the issue. There was actually a period of time where we did leave in the word for several pages before we finally stopped waffling about it.
Our final consensus was that yeah, it was probably funny at the time, but the word has evolved to be associated with cruelty, not comedy. Our dad was not a cruel man, and I think that he wouldn’t have wanted to be associated with hurting people. he himself even stopped using the word in his everyday lexicon when it became more than just a rude joke. Consider it like how reboots of old movies will remove outdated and poorly aged segments. You can still laugh at the original, but within the context of the modern era it just doesn’t read like it’s meant to. Instead it just makes him look like a giant asshole to anyone who wasn’t here when the joke was first made.
So the word’s been nixed in the reboot. I’m sorry to anyone who was attached to the original joke. But I’m not too keen on anyone seeing my dad as someone who advocated for cruelty.
Starcraft 2: Rush Analysis
I write a program to simulate different strategies in Starcraft 2, to see how they compare.
The Biggest Game Ever
Just how big IS No Man's Sky? What if you made a map of all of its landmass? How big would it be?
The Dumbest Cutscene
This is it. This is the dumbest cutscene ever created for a AAA game. It's so bad it's simultaneously hilarious and painful. This is "The Room" of video game cutscenes.
Skylines of the Future
Cities: Skylines is bound to have a sequel sooner or later. Where can this series go next, and what changes would I like to see?
The Disappointment Engine
No Man's Sky is a game seemingly engineered to create a cycle of anticipation and disappointment.
To be fair guiding players is one of the finer points of the GMing art. You want them to have as much freedom as possible but at the same time to not screw themselves over. You want them to make their own decisions based on what they have figured out but sometimes, especially when weeks or even months pass between game sessions they’ll forget or mix stuff up. And then there is the fact that the players are not in your head and they can build up completely different assumptions, or interpret their character differently than you expect.
So yeah, you want them to use the evil amulet of evil down the line to leverage its connection to the big bad but don’t want to reveal that it’s an option too early? They’ll decide that it’s an evil artifact and try to destroy it. So suddenly it’s warded by powerful magic. So they’ll start looking for a place to drop it into the ocean. So you’ll say it’s cursed to always come back to them… and before you know it it’ll become this whole thing where all you meant for them to do was to lug this thing around for half the campaing to later reveal that a scrying spell can be cast with it as a focus but now they’re all fixated on whether this thing is corrupting them and how to get rid of it.
And while you can try to “fix” this honestly probably the best thing to do is to embrace it. Escalate. Soon enough the players are questing to find the sages who can have knowledge of this amulet and you can still rope them into most of the stuff you had planned along the way. If you play your cards right they might thing this was your plan all along or even feel smart for figuring it out.
You always want to give your players the ability to make mistakes. BUT sometimes you’ve written in something REALLY AWESOME that *you* think is obvious. Hopefully you don’t plan this moment to occur right at the start of the session, because you’re gonna have to figure out how to get the players to go the right direction without railroading them; OR have some other backup plan you can execute. Leaving it completely open works for some DM’s; but I’ve found at best it only works *sometimes* for even the best.
In fairness to Aragorn in this comic too, he makes a darn good point. How the heck are the three of them supposed to crew an entire fleet of ships by themselves? The ghostly army won’t be able to help; they’re incorporeal and can’t manipulate the sails/ropes/rudders etc.
Indeed. At best they’ll be able to crew 1 of the ships, though that is also all they should need. If the ghosts are incorporeal and can’t touch the boats, you don’t need boats to carry them either.
The scene of the ships’ arrival at the docks always* irks me, because of how wrong it looks. Several ships under full sail without crew just glide to the pier…and stop, still under full sail.
If the orcs had reacted to this eery sight somehow, it make for a cool ghost ship vibe. But instead, they apparently suspect nothing wrong until the ghost surprise.
It makes me think the animators didn’t know how boats work. Like if the Lone Ranger rides into town and stops in front of the saloon, but the horse legs keep galloping.
*I say always because I love these movies and frequently rewatch them, despite any minor gripes :)
I can’t remember how the books covered this *at all*, to be fair. But in the movies, my interpretation was that the ghosts “scared” the requisite crews to sail the ships to where they needed. Of course, you need to not think about it too hard.
That sounds like the most reasonable way to go about it, agreed.
But in the movie there is visibly no one on the ships’ decks until the Three jump out of their hiding spot. I think the idea was that ghosts did in fact sail the ships. in some sort of poltergeist form (invisible but able to manipulate objects).
I think that’s because showing our heroes force prisoners to labour for them would be a little bit undercutting heir heroism. (Could have been solved by having the crew be slaves that our heroes free and then ask for help).
But the whole arc was so very rushed and abridged in the movie. You’re right in that thinking about it too hard isn’t going to help. But it’s LOTR, I want to think about it :)
In the books, Aragorn calls upon the Army of the Dead to drive away the corsairs of Umbar manning the boats at Pelargir (they don’t actually come to Minas Tirith at all). The boats are then manned by a company of Gondorians “from Lebennin and the Ethir” who do the sailing.
Ah. That makes sense. I remembered *part* of it correctly.
I wish that was in the extended cut.
He also wasn’t just accompanied by Legolas and Gimli, but by the Grey Company – Rangers from the north, his people, come to aid him. They met him in Rohan and followed him through the mountains. Then as they sail up Anduin they gather reinforcements from the towns and cities along the way, men that could not previously be spared for the defence of Minas Tirith due to the threat of Umbar.
Why did you change the dialogue of Aragorn?! :-( What was his original line?
“Are you dead or regarded?”
It’s my favorite line from this comic, don’t know why they thought their change was funnier. It’s not. It’s too long and meandering.
Where’s my comment? I said the same thing but my comment got eaten. Do they not want people to know they’ve changed the comic? Very weird
The “R” word, which commenter Kris below referenced as “regarded” rather than the actual word to keep the comment from being blocked, is broadly considered a slur now. This is one of the insulting concepts that is the rewrite tries to correct. The word once had a wide-use technical meaning. About the same time the word started being used as a casual insult research into mental illnesses and other mental affectations such as some degrees of autism were understood well enough to demonstrate that the more simple descriptions of decades past were un-helpful. At that point all that was left was using the word as a demeaning insult.
Some people don’t like that words change meaning over time because of usage and understanding, and some don’t like that the insults they used as a child are considered rude now. Some people are even barely aware that this has been a big issue the past decade.
And some people cringe to see extreme vulgar language presented as if it were written by Shamus.
The online usage of this offensive outdated term is vulgar as well, and is meant to be. Replacing it with less hurtful but still vulgar phrasing preserves the tone and sentiment while removing the slur that’s unnecessary to the point being made by the character here.
The term he used was not meant to be offensive or vulgar. . It was meant to be funny. I think his work should be left alone. At the very least changes should be cited. How rude to publish this with his name on it.
Grandma, he stopped using the word when it became more than just an insult. It was meant to be funny at the time, yeah. But it’s not funny anymore, its cruel. And I like to think he wouldn’t have wanted to be associated with cruelty. That’s why we edited it.
Well, then why didn’t he censor the re-release of the Chainmail Bikini strip where he was accused of joking about sexual assault? What he did, was he re-released it and gave us more context about the time when it was written and what he meant by it. He didn’t even change the order he released it in, even though that would have lessened the impact of the controversy it re-iginted. He’s said multiple times that the
text is the text.
…That quote you pulled has nothing to do with the re-release of Chainmail Bikini, or even, this topic.
Here is the full quote: “Unless you address me personally, I’m not going to jump in and attempt to fix perceived plot holes with extra-textual post-release patches. I’m a big believer in the idea that the text is the text and everything outside the text is fanfic, even if it was written by me. If something isn’t explained well enough then making up shit later doesn’t fix that.”
You’re talking an awful lot about what my dad would have wanted for someone who just posted a bad faith and out of context quote, something he despised.
You can’t use ‘I’m not gonna fix plot holes on my book like J.K. Rowling on Twitter’ as a way to argue he’d want us to keep slurs in a comic he wrote’s remaster the original is still there you absolute lima bean.
I will be removing your future comments on this thread unless they are in good faith and courteous, it is clear you have very big feelings on the subject, which is fine but this comment was not made with the truth at heart or kindness in mind.
How is the replacement “brain dead” any less cruel? Brain-dead people are people too, you know. Or, “Stubby” as an epithet for Gimli, for that matter? Why not replace that with “vertically challenged” to be “politically correct”?
I agree with Grandma. Leave Shamus’s lines alone, and write your own comic, if you want to make a “less offensive” one.
Why is it considered a slur? What about “moron” or “idiot”? They’ve got the exact same connotation. The way “regarded” is used is here and the way it was used back then was as a replacement for “stupid”. It wasn’t meant as a slur against disabled people and everyone knew that.
It’s also common decency to say that you’ve changed something as part of a remaster. Otherwise it looks like you’re trying to hide the fact that Shamus said something you don’t like. If you’re gonna change stuff, at least have the courage to stand behind your decisions. Don’t try to hide them because people will notice.
It does not just mean ‘idiot’. It has a very specific meaning that is based on since revised incomplete appreciation of some people’s traits, people who commonly have a history of not been valued by the systems intended to help them.
The word was very much meant to mean that in the common usage in the time of this comic’s original writing, too. Just compare it to some other words frequently shouted across online matches. The fact that common usage has blunted the shock value of these words to people not traumatised by them does not change that they were meant to be crass and insulting, or that they remain traumatising to some people.
Idiot and moron have the exact same connotation. They used to be actual medical terms, just like regard. They’re older than regard even though they’re newer than the n-word. Why does regard get special treatment while idiot and moron don’t?
It’s not a helpful question unless you’re authentically considering if you should be saying idiot or moron. It doesn’t matter why. People who have been horribly, horribly treated in the past and now are asking for a little kindness of not using some mouth sounds that we used to hurt them anymore. Even if it’s just a show of solidarity, it matters. I understand you disagree, but it’s staying out. We never made any attempt to hide the changes, we talked about it at length even here when we were first deciding.
I wrote the new text because I thought it was a funny new line. I could have replaced it with a number of other things but I figured trying to put something fresh would help with the problem of people feeling like we were just slapping censors on things. But honestly, I think people will be mad no matter what we do about it. I like the new line and felt proud I got to contribute to my dads work.
I would normally default to ‘keep the original with a footnote to highlight the changed context’, but in this case I think the replacement is the better line. One is a bog-standard playground insult, the other keeps the insult but adds a bit of wordplay.
In most parts of the world “idiot” still carries that connotation and it was very widely used.
As some of you probably know, one of Dostoevsky’s most famous novels is called “The Idiot” and it’s about a noble who pretends to have a mental deficiency so that people can underestimate him. Such a good book!
Great example. I wish I had thought of it. All I could think of was Huckleberry Finn or Gone with the Wind or Parallell Lives by Plutarch- or a fig leaf on Michaelangelo’s iconic statue of David.
I was not aware of that, but will now try to avoid using those words, too. Thank you for this info!
Shamus wouldn’t have used the r word? Well he most definitely would not have used the phrase that replaced his actual line. Your generation is bothered by the r word and my generation is bothered by the f word. Neither one of us has the right to impose our preferences on his work. This thread is NOT about the past mistreatment of intellectually challenged people. This thread is about respect for the artist and respect for the reader who, just like you, is capable of putting this in its historical context. My generation has lived through and swallowed a lot of changes. Why can today’s generation not be expected to understand and accept change? Why is your sensibility about the r word more important than my sensibility about doing violence to Shamus’ work. Let his work stand. Otherwise you demean it and him.
I’m sorry you feel that way grandma. Luckily, the original is still there to read, we aren’t making any motion to remove it, of course!
I’m sorry you’ll miss out on a few extra pixels in the process, but it’s made with an entirely different comic creator and with different fonts anyway. Not because we want to demean him, but because the comic creator he used no longer exists. I’d NEVER delete his original work, but I’m not putting hate in a remaster, which is, by it’s nature, a fan-creation and not the original no matter what we do.
I wish it was dad making this remaster. He would either be more respected in a decision to remove the slurs, or in his own right to keep them. Also, I just miss him and if he was making this it would mean he was here. But he can’t, and we can’t ask him; which I grapple with every single day.
In the future if you have an issue with something we’re doing here please talk to us directly instead of inciting a riot, I’ve told you how bad the comments and emails that you don’t see are. I would really enjoy not being on the receiving end of death and violence threats because my grandmother hit the wasps nest that is some of my dads old readership.
I thought I was participating in a respectful interesting discussion but I take your point. I love your phrase “wasps nest that is some of my Dad’s old readership.”- Good writing there, IMHO.
This is an interesting case study in translation. People don’t realize that translation has to occur between generations even. The whole field of constitutional law is an exercise in translating the text from an era that has passed and making it applicable today. The ultimate problem with translation is it is impossible to retain everything. There is no one-to-one match between words in different languages or even the same word in the same language separated by even just a few years. There are multiple strategies to work through this, but all of them leave at least some people disappointed. You can leave things as is, which isn’t translation and can lead to certain kinds of misunderstandings(such as in the case of the King James Version of the Bible) where people think they understand, but they don’t really. This is actually one of the worst situations to be in because you don’t even know you’ve made a mistake. Other solutions include notations that explain the difference while keeping the original in the text. Even other solutions change the word(s) and try to use either a synonym or phrase that tries to capture the meaning of the original for a new audience, the key here is a new audience. It is important to note that NONE of these solutions are perfect. The best you can really do is be as transparent about the process as possible for people to avoid misunderstanding. Things that are poetic, comical, or otherwise idiomatic are notoriously hard to translate because the hooks that create the layers of meaning are always different between people, places, and languages and they fall flat. A joke with one group of people falls flat with a different group of people. Context is highly important, and that is one of the things that can’t be easily imbued in the text. Ever wonder why explaining a joke makes it less funny? This is why.