Knights of the Old Republic EP27: PURPOL LITESABARZ!

By Shamus
on Oct 30, 2015
Filed under:
Spoiler Warning

58 comments


Link (YouTube)

Knights of the Old Republic lets you dual-wield purple lightsabers, which qualifies it for Game of the Year. No, not this year. Every year.

About 4 and a half minutes in, Josh tries to go to another planet and the screen goes blank. Chris says “Oh! We’re on Tatooine!” This probably seems strange, so let me explain:

Josh is streaming the game to the rest of us while he plays. KOTOR is ancient in terms of videogame technology, and it does not like our screwy setup. Sometimes it abruptly minimizes itself when trying to play a pre-rendered cutscene. Josh edits this out of the final video, but the rest of us see it when it happens. In this case, the game minimized itself and we found ourselves looking at Josh’s desktop, which features a desert scene.

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Footnotes:



20201858 comments. It's getting crowded in here.

From the Archives:

  1. Gruhunchously says:

    Tatooine is to Star Wars as London is to Doctor Who.

  2. Slothfulcobra says:

    “Your face is all scrunched up like a kinrath pup”

    How does that work? Do Kinrath even have faces?

  3. On the thing about Bastila having a complete different set of skills and be leveled differently later, that reminds me of one of the final quests of NWN2. It is clear before the end that some of your companions will turn to the enemy and you’ll fight them. So when you see it coming, you take them in your party and remove everything they carry, letting them naked. When it’s the time for them to step to the villain’s side, he tells you something like “Oh, so you took every piece of equipment from him, huh? So you think you’re smart, huh? Well, guess what, I’ve given him now some equipment that’s better than what he had before”.

    I like Carth. I understand for an evil character he shows some issues in which BioWare did wrong. But you seem hating him beyond that? I like him.

    Regarding his issue with evil characters, in a way it was something I like to have seen tried, though I agree it doesn’t work. Other games raise my eyebrows when, by the better end of allowing the player to do what he wants, you see good aligned characters joining in mindless murdering of innocents. In Baldur’s Gate (I’ll make up the example, as I don’t remember the exact thing), if you decide to murder the orphan who asked a coin to get the three he already has, Imoen, Jaheira, Khalid and the paladin will join in beating the kid, then they will say how horrible you have been. Even the one who landed the final blow to the orphan. Carth is the character that stays true to his alignment and instead of killing the orphan and then lecturing you, he lectures you, he not joins the killing and he doesn’t allow it. The problems with this are: A) It happens to be your first companion and so, for a while, you’re forced to use him or go alone, which takes out the option to pick someone else so you’ll be able to go through with your evil, B) The evil choices are stupid evil choices, nothing more subtle that Carth may let go because either he may nor realize how evil they are or they’re not as evil as to get over his need to work with you and C) There is no choice, after Carth stops you, to do it anyway. They don’t want to let the player figth and kill Carth to do them, personal quest and all. With that, Carth becomes the game telling the player “you can’t do that”, which is a bad idea. I wonder, could work something like “Aren’t two Black Vulkars behind the corner over there watching us? Why don’t you go check? Now that we’re alone, kid, you give me your money or I beat you. Stab! Hah, got proof of your death. The woman? Oh yes, I told her I’d say nothing” or “Well, if we don’t get this and we don’t complete our mission then she’ll be killed, so if he doesn’t give us his money someone will die. Therefore, money. Here. Now”? I mean, a choice in which you get rid of Carth momentarily to make the evil option, you do it without the game breaking Carth’s character. It would be hard to make, more so in a game with a party system like Kotor’s, I guess.

    • manofsteles says:

      “Oh, so you took every piece of equipment from him, huh? So you think you’re smart, huh? Well, guess what, I’ve given him now some equipment that’s better than what he had before”

      Did NWN2 also do this if you just gave them low-quality equipment?

      On a related note, did KOTOR do that with Mission, Zalbaar, Juhani, or Jolee if the player chose the dark side route on Lehon and joined Bastila and overthrew Malak to rule over the Sith and took away all of their equipment?

      • Grudgeal says:

        Yes. For example, I never used that annoying sorceress-lady so I got that line. Apparently, the game thought I was intentionally trying to cheat it by choosing not to use a dreadful character I loathe.

      • John says:

        I don’t think that the game recognizes the player’s attempts to meta-game except in Pazaak. Pazaak players will generally cut you off if you save-scum your way to too many consecutive victories.

        • NoneCallMeTim says:

          I believe there is an exploit to that: if you lose the first game (for any amount). Save. Then you can continue winning, as the computer has seen you lose at least once.

          • GloatingSwine says:

            Nah, the cutoff is if you win x amount of games more than you lose.

            However, most of them have some kind of special reward when you get to that point. The most important being good old Suvam Tan who will give you a whacking 20% discount at his shop. (which given that all his stuff is really expensive and good is very nice indeed).

    • Will says:

      “On the thing about Bastila having a complete different set of skills and be leveled differently later, that reminds me of one of the final quests of NWN2. It is clear before the end that some of your companions will turn to the enemy and you’ll fight them. So when you see it coming, you take them in your party and remove everything they carry, letting them naked. When it’s the time for them to step to the villain’s side, he tells you something like ‘Oh, so you took every piece of equipment from him, huh? So you think you’re smart, huh? Well, guess what, I’ve given him now some equipment that’s better than what he had before’.”

      Shamus has already commented on this phenomenon. (Incidentally, if I recall correctly, in that case the game just gives you their stuff when it takes them away. There’s a point much later where a character can permanently walk off with whatever good kit you’ve dressed them in, though.)

      • manofsteles says:

        “There’s a point much later where a character can permanently walk off with whatever good kit you’ve dressed them in, though.”

        Is that when Morrigan leaves before the Battle of Denerim? Or is that some other time? In my playthroughs, I never actually had any of the main companions leave besides her.

        EDIT: I know that Wynne and/or Leliana can leave or attack the player if the Ashes of Andraste are desecrated, but I never did that and don’t know if they will simply leave and take the stuff you gave them.

  4. Andy says:

    Czerka and Czerberus sound the same, too… Assonant assholes, as it were.

    • Slothfulcobra says:

      Czerka actually has a business plan. If you talk to a guy on Dantooine, he’ll rant at you about how Czerka has a deal to work with the With.

      Which, incidentally, probably also gives them a bigger market for slaves, although I think there are pockets of slavery throughout the Republic?

  5. Wide And Nerdy says:

    I used to have the problem with autominimizing. I can’t remember what I did to fix it. Either deleted the videos or downloaded a set that were scaled to the right resolution (they were still low res of course but the point is, they were the right ratio or pixel count I believe).

    If you weren’t doing this for a spoiler warning, I’d recommend deleting all the prerendered vids. They look comically worse than the game does now (especially if you have texture mods) and they cause problems for non streamers. Doubly so for KOTOR 2 where minimizing can inexplicably lead to crashing to desktop.

  6. Wide And Nerdy says:

    Mass Effect 3 had fun weapon customization (I have no basis for comparison other than other mass effects, I don’t play shooters).

    Aside from the fact that the mods did have some decent impact, ME3 had a system where carrying less weight in weapons led to faster power cooldowns. So you weren’t just tweaking the weapons performance, you were balancing weapon usage against power usage allowing for greater flexibility of playstyle. I also liked that each skill at the higher tiers gave you two choices per upgrade. And some of those mods did make the weapon lighter.

    • djw says:

      I am finally playing through me3 for the first time right now, and I agree that all of those features are fun, and provide interesting trade offs. My adept Shepard feels vastly more powerful in me3 than she did in me2, due to the 200% cooldown reduction with lightweight loadouts.

      • Wide And Nerdy says:

        Obviously being a regular you know what you’re in for. I’d advised you focus on enjoying the gameplay. This is probably the only Bioware game ever where the gameplay was more enjoyable than the story/companions (for all the wrong reasons).

        • djw says:

          I got through ME2 mostly on the basis of the gameplay as well. So far that part of ME3 is fun. I’ve only encountered Kaileng once though, and I already hate him. (Correction, I hate the author who inflicted his ninja fantasy self into the science fiction game that I was for the most part enjoying).

  7. Henson says:

    My first time through Mass Effect, I played as a female. I got to the end credits, saw ‘Commander Shepard – Jennifer Hale’, and did a double-take. “…Bastila? That was Bastila? I played through that whole game and never realized it?” That was the moment that made me really respect Jennifer Hale’s work.

    And shortly thereafter, her recognition within the gaming scene exploded.

    • Wide And Nerdy says:

      I was surprised by that too. Also surprised at the other voices Mark Meer can do (which leads me to believe he was getting bad direction.) He voiced the Biotic GOD for example (I think he did a lot of Volus voices).

      • James says:

        Yea people like to take the piss out of Mark Meer, but i genuinely think it was bad/no direction, like the voice director told him to be as bland as possible so it players can just become shep or whatever.

        • Wide And Nerdy says:

          Its about Hale. The people who praise Hale want to tear down her counterpart to make her look better. Its like Star Trek and Star Wars, Bioware and Obsidian and a bunch of others.

          I thought Meer did fine, especially in 3 relative to Hale.

          Gamers With Jobs made a point that whoever wrote Shepard and the Illusive Man had some experience with management because they found it believable that both characters could obtain someone’s trust and loyalty (based on their specific behavior, lets not get into Cerberus’ reputation here). If the writers were trying to take this approach and paint Shepard as similar to a real life well trained manager, it could explain why Meer sounds like a school counselor a lot of the time.

        • Ringwraith says:

          So it goes, he was brought in to do some placeholder stuff, but they ended up just rolling with instead.
          Would explain why his voice acting generally improves a lot as the series progresses, as they actually invested in it.

        • Sabrdance (MatthewH) says:

          I actually like Meer’s delivery. He totally sounds like the Marine Officers I grew up around. Sure, he’s not James Bond, but… he’s not James Bond so the fact that he sounds like a fairly normal marine hasn’t bothered me. On certain areas, I actually like his delivery better. Hale’s “Stupid Jellyfish” delivery is way over the top. Meer’s, you can hear the exasperated eye-roll.

          • Wide And Nerdy says:

            She doesn’t do deadpan as well as Meer does.

            Take the Citadel DLC. Compare how each one tells the hamster to “go for the eyes”. Hale’s delivery makes it sound like the character is making a joke or that she’s winking to the audience, Meer’s delivery makes it sound like Shepard is serious, which is funnier to me.

      • Keeshhound says:

        Mark Meer’s crowning achievement continues to be Jethann.

  8. Wide And Nerdy says:

    Dual Purple Lightsabers. This may be important later on. Heather you might want to take notes based on how Shamus was reacting.

  9. John says:

    It’s too bad that Josh hasn’t had enough conversations with Bastila to trigger Bastila’s side quest–one of three companion quests requiring you to go to Tattooine. It’s great. You get to meet Bastila’s mother. I would love to hear what the people who can’t stand Bastila think of her.

    Incidentally, has anyone ever triggered or completed Bastila’s side quest after finding the Star Map on Tattooine? I would also like to know how that goes.

    • Supahewok says:

      Nothing really changes. You just go back to the Krayt Dragon Lair, and either a new lootable object spawns with the holocron or a previously unclickable object becomes clickable, I’ve never figured out which. And you just take it straight back. There isn’t even a dialogue option to state that you’ve already killed the Krayt Dragon when you get the quest to go to its cave.

      But something funny happened to me last time I did it. I was trying to ding Level 17 before reaching the Leviathan to have enough Repair to fully unlock HK’s backstory. So, I was actually flitting around quite a bit between planets, trying to maximise my XP intake. I’d already finished Tatooine (my 2nd planet), and gone on to Manaan, triggering the cutscene where Malak sends his apprentice to hunt you down. If you play the game how its meant to be played, then you should run into him as you leave whatever dungeon the Starmap for the 3rd planet is in: in my case, as I leave the underwater facility on Manaan.

      HOWEVER, the actual scripting is just that he pops up whenever you leave ANY Starmap dungeon. So, while putting off the underwater facility, I returned to Tatooine. I went back to the Krayt Dragon lair, turned around, and lo and behold he popped up out of nowhere. I got a kick out of him showing up in the wrong place. It also undercut a little of the narrative tension: you’re supposed to slay the apprentice only about an hour before you meet Darth Malak for the not first time, which I always felt added a little bit of implied friction or something. A little bit of ramp-up to the Leviathan and the confrontation. That sure got screwed up.

  10. Mintskittle says:

    Listening to everyone’s reaction on leaving Kashyyyk, you’d think Josh would’ve replaced the fly away cutscene with the Exterminatus of Typhon Primaris.

    Why don’t more games let the player blow up planets? If the place has been exceedingly aggravating, blowing it up would be very cathartic.

  11. Grimwear says:

    The funny thing with ME1 is that if you don’t add any damage boosts and instead just pump I believe frictionless materials you can end up with an assault rifle that never overheats. And that is what I did. Was it the best? Not particularly but dangit it let me shoot forever and that was good enough for me. Also nothing looks quite so amazing as shooting and never seeing the heat meter fill.

    • Daemian Lucifer says:

      There is one thing better than that:Nonstop explosive ammo.

      • Majere says:

        Better yet making an improvised rocket launcher out of a sniper rifle. Yes it overheated in one shot but it also killed anything in the vicinity of the impact.

    • Spacewreck says:

      If you picked up the Spectre X assault rifle you could equip inferno rounds along with frictionless materials you could fire nonstop without overheating. The only potential drawback is that it feels almost mandatory to do the Rambo roar when you’re firing nonstop for more than 30 seconds while hosing a cave full of husks down.

      If you did the same with a sniper rifle you could use explosive rounds. It would overheat with every shot but the cooldown was shorter than the time it took to jack another round in the chamber so it was as nonstop as a sniper rifle gets. It made me wish there more setups like the one where you escape the nuke by slipping through the back of the cave and then get to use the Hand of God sniper rifle from on high to blow away the whole merc team that trapped you.

  12. Loonyyy says:

    Shamus’ childlike delight at the purple lightsabers filled my heart with joy.

    I’m feeling really down, and that made my day, it reminded me of how happy I was getting to pick my purple lightsaber in Jedi Academy.

    • Spacewreck says:

      I loved the purple lightsaber too, and made sure to vary everyone else’s lightsabers so we could get as many colors of the rainbow flashing as possible. BTW, did anyone else change the Jedis’ robes around as necessary to make the best sartorial match you could with each Jedi’s lightsaber? It just wouldn’t have been a proper Jedi Dance Fight without it IMO.

      “I’ve quadrupuled my flip power!”

      • Sabrdance (MatthewH) says:

        Normally, I color code lightsabers to keep a generally color-theory (or at least heraldic-friendly) team. So if someone is using two lightsabers, they can have 1 tint and 1 metal.

        But now I kinda want to roll a team with all the same lightsaber colors. Go Team Purple!

      • Loonyyy says:

        I try to make each character look right, I haven’t quite finished KOTOR, switched computers part way through so I need to recover that save.

        I really dig purple, especially purple lightsabers, I loved Mace Windu’s purple blade. Blue’s probably a second, the other colours work nicely as pairs with them.Orange, red, or yellow and purple look pretty cool.

        I usually prefer the saber staff though, double sabers is cool, but the staff is just too much for me.

        I loved the character creator in Jedi Knight, I pretty much only used two different outfits on the Human, but I had fun with it. And you can pick the trim of the robe if you choose the one that looks like a Jedi robe, so you can match the saber and the outfit.

        Getting to mix and match crystals and parts in KOTOR is one of the high points of the game. It’s kind of silly in regard to the lore, and if you’re like me, and have almost no knowledge of DnD (Which makes weapon stats very confusing) it’s hard to use and kind of pointless, but putting your own saber together and picking the stuff (You have a limited one in Jedi Academy too), just reaches back into my childhood and the original films.

  13. Daemian Lucifer says:

    Mindscrewing with people is the best.Using axii in witcher 3 for even the most mundane stuff was so satisfying.

  14. Michael Ebert says:

    Just heard you guys talking about metagaming for dark side points, and wanted to point out that I think you can actually max out dark side points (or at least get really close to it) by the end of DANTOOINE, which is rediculous.

    • Metal C0Mmander says:

      I think you might be able to do it on Taris if you try hard enough. I’m not basing that on anything beside the fact that it’s actually pretty easy to gain light/dark side points.

  15. The Defenestrator says:

    I like how you guys make fun of the idea of people having random fights in the middle of Anchorhead before running off to get in a random fight with some dark Jedi in the middle of Anchorhead.

    Also, why is this town called “Anchorhead”? Surely there are no anchors in use on this planet.

  16. Wide And Nerdy says:

    Word is, Samuel Jackson requested a purple lightsaber so he could point out his character to his kids or something like that.

  17. Metal C0Mmander says:

    So all a game needs to be one of your best game of all time is purple lightsabers? Well I think it’s about time you reevaluate SWTOR.

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