Spoiler Warning S4E51: Three Hour Relay Race

By Mumbles Posted Thursday Mar 10, 2011

Filed under: Spoiler Warning 172 comments

Link (YouTube)

I forgot to say this during the episode because I was drowning in cough medicine and two shots of whiskey, but I know why it takes three hours to get through the relay. Sweet, sweet Garrus love making. Yeah, that’s right ladies. Straight up naked Turian action. But, since we didn’t romance anyone during this Let’s Play, we get a fully-clothed Miranda instead. Joygasm.

Obviously, if I had a choice I’d have Regina romance the hell out of Garrus, but my second option would have to be Tali. I mean, why not? BioWare doesn’t have anything against girl on girl (or even boy on boy) action. She also invited me to share suit air like we were exchanging friendship bracelets! If that’s not a Quarian come on, I don’t know what is.

But, the best BioWare romance that never was will always be Canderous. YOU WILL LIVE ON IN MY HEART, MIGHTY MANDALORE.


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172 thoughts on “Spoiler Warning S4E51: Three Hour Relay Race

  1. Piflik says:

    Hope you get well soon (if you aren’t already)…on the bright side, your sick voice sounds incredibly sexy ;)

    1. Integer Man says:

      When aren’t you drowning in cough medicine and whisky, though?

    2. eric says:

      I guess it was inevitable that getting a human female on Spoiler Warning would lead to a bunch of creeps hitting on her.

    3. Drew says:

      Do not listen to this man. He is insane.

      (Er, but get well soon, yes. You should listen to him on that. But I don’t think you need our advice in that arena.)

  2. overpowered ginger says:

    hey, wait a minute, the video doesn’t work!
    …you cheapskates

    1. Mumbles says:

      Oh, balls. There it should be public now.

      1. overpowered ginger says:

        thank you.
        *vault boy thumbs up*

      2. BeamSplashX says:

        I’m pleased to hear someone else say “oh balls”, though I expect nothing less from you.

        GO TEAM BALLS!*

        *Another workable name to put on the Normandy over Cerberus.

        1. Mumbles says:

          My roommates asked me to come up with some PG rated cuss words for when we’re out in public. Oh balls was the best I could come up with besides a very over the top GOLLY GUMDROPS.

          1. NotACat says:

            Wasn’t it you talking about “kittens” a few episodes back?

  3. rayen says:

    I’m going to type my first thought when a character dies.

    Thane – “alas poor lemon head.”

    …. awww only one death? oh well. continued next episode.

    1. Slothful says:

      Madness! Thane is green with a couple spots, whereas Lemons are yellow! I will fight a flame war with you to the END OF TIME.

      1. rayen says:

        alas poor orange head ;D

      2. Christopher M says:

        Alas poor limey, we knew him not.

    2. SpammyV says:

      I imagine that one day after the events of Mass Effect 3, Shepard will be giving an interview for the History Channel about fighting the Collectors.

      “Oh, Jacob. I miss Jacob. Only a little. Saluted me like a moron. Always disagreed with Miranda. He was the first one to die you know. Sent him off on that mission and that was it.”

      “Uh… what about Thane? The records show he was crushed by a bulkhead before you reached the Collector base.”

      “Who? I never hired anybody named Thane.”

      “But the security footage from the building show-”

      “LOOK SONNY I THINK I WAS THERE AND I THINK I CAN REMEMBER HOW THE THING HAPPENED oh screw this. I’m tired of your disingenuous accusations. ”

      *Shepard Pawnch*

  4. Chris B Chikin says:

    I really didn’t like the Garrus romance. The dialogue sounded like the two of them were planning a high school biology experiment or building an Ikea flatpack. Sure, the chemistry wasn’t bad, but there was just too much squick.

    1. Kale says:

      Squick to you, the exciting world of sexy biology to them.

      1. Bret says:

        By “sexy” do you mean hilariously awkward?

        Because that’s one of the best things about that romance. The whole thing has “We are committing a crime against nature, aren’t we?” as a running theme.

        1. Audacity says:

          What I want to know is why every race in the universe has perfectly compatible hardware. Shouldn’t so many lifeforms from so many planets be a little more disparate? It’s like they’re all equipped with USB systems; why aren’t there any TRS or RCA Jacks out there?

          EDIT: I just read what I wrote… That was one hell of a bad mental image. I apologize.

          1. fish miner says:

            I agree, I thought the Asari worked out to be a pretty interesting race in Mass Effect because Bioware had to have a justification for cross species lesbo sex and a lot of the culture ended up revolving around that, but throwing other species into that mix sort of devalues the whole thing in my eyes. Given this is a space opera so drama lama stuff evidently takes precedence over logic and it is kinda funny to watch the game turn into a low difficulty japanese dating sim.

          2. Daemian Lucifer says:

            Well,we dont know if they have perfectly compatable hardware.We only see them cuddle a bit dressed before fading to black,so who knows what they are doing then.Maybe they engage just in oral pleasures.And while on that topic,consider that thane is a lizard guy,and lizards have looooong tongues.I,unlike Audacity,am not sorry about that bad mental image.

            1. Klay F. says:

              If I remember correctly, Mordin advises FemShep to “not swallow” if she romances Garrus, so I would imagine they would avoid “oral pleasures”, unless by “oral pleasures” you mean quoting Monty Python and The Holy Grail verbatim.

              1. Josh R says:

                He also informs you that if you lick thane, it will cause you to hallucinate.

            2. Slothful says:

              Yeah, I sorta like the idea that they reeeeeeeeeeeaaaaallly aren’t truly compatible, and they’re just wiggling around their own respective proper bits right next to each other. Like why would the Asari…have one of…if there is no need for…genetic material.

              I kinda like the idea that maybe the Asari actually have something…else down there, if only because it’d be hilariously uncomfortable for Shepard to find out the truth.

              It’s like that one flash movie that was making fun of Avatar.

              1. krellen says:

                As far as we know, Asari still have live births, so they’re still in need of a birthing canal.

                1. Daemian Lucifer says:

                  Putting your bits into the wrong bits is even worse than having incompatible bits.Boy,mass effect universe is ripe for all kinds of new fetishes to blossom.I can already imagine it:

                  “Watch the all new exciting ‘hold your breath for climax’ where we pair volus with another race and see who can climax first in the small window of opportunity!”

            3. Audacity says:

              Urgh. Son of a… Brain bleach! Where’s my damn brain bleach!?

    2. Drew says:

      You’re right. It would have been much stronger if they had ignored the fact that the person you’re trying to romance has fucking scales all over him. That’s a much better way to handle it.

      The problem here is that most of the optoins you’re given really aren’t that great. The humans, in particular, are useless as romantic parnters: Miranda is incompetent while hung up on herself, Jack has serious baggage, Jacob walls himself off for no reason, Kaiden is too afraid and passive to be any use and Ashley is a stuck-up xenophobe. (Although it does amuse me that Ashley is aggressive whereas Kaiden is all, “I’d like to talk to you about my feelings Commander”) In 1, Liara is the best of a bad lot, but she’s less sexual to me and more like a kid I want to protect… usually from renegade male Shepard, which, is uncomfortable. After that, all we’re left with as viable romance options are Garrus, Thain and Tali. All of which have serious physical repercussions to one or both of them if the romance continues. Samara would be an interesting optoin but the game doesn’t let you, which i think is wise, though I wish they would have made her a bit firmer in her resolve. Instead it’s “Oh, Shepard, I’ve met you 5 hours ago and seen you do things that would compel me to violence if I was not under oath and yet oh I YEARN” which is ridiculous. But everyone kind of acts that way to a certain extent, and this is a video game, where they all need to stroke your ego in this way for whatever reason.

      If Kelly had been an option i probably would have gone for that, male or female. Intriguingly, she apparently has the hots for Thain, and I’m not one to cockblock, so… Garrus it is.

  5. The ‘forcefield that keeps atmosphere in but allows passage of other things’ is a time-honoured sci-fi trope. Everything from Star Trek to Stargate SG-1 abuses and loves this trope to death. It’s not s’bad.

    Ah, and the good old action movie gut-wound of death. Because they refuse to have characters just take it to the face for some reason.

    1. ehlijen says:

      The audience might not be able to tell which character just died if the only distinguishing feature in most war movies is the one that got hit.

    2. psivamp says:

      Actually that type of thing is possible with current tech. It’s called a plasma window. You heat up some inert gas until it becomes a plasma and then suspend that in a magnetic field.

      But, in a setting where you can have full-on force fields that deflect missles/torpedos/other ships, it doesn’t really make sense to have these shields that don’t block mass or to have them set that way during an invasion if it’s just a setting.

      1. Daemian Lucifer says:

        Umm,how is anything going to go through plasma?I mean sure,the atoms will end up on the other side,but I wouldnt call that passing through.

        Though it actually does make sense to have a field that deflects only gases but not solids.It may be the one that requires the least energy to operate,for example.

        1. Raygereio says:

          The only current aplication that I know that uses a plasma window in such a fashion is in a electro beam welder. There it’s used to seal of a vaccuum, but still allow electrons to pass through.

          But yeah, I would recommend putting regular “stuff” through something that’s in a state of plasma.

          1. Specktre says:

            Do you mean “Wouldn’t”?

    3. zob says:

      This really shouldn’t need explaining. Magic eyeball thingy attacks the hull opens a hole and gets in, then shields activate.

      1. Daemian Lucifer says:

        Except it goes outside that whole,without firing a single shot.

        1. zob says:

          Yeah, I missed that.

        2. Ringwraith says:

          It;s actually rams itself into the ship, you can see it tuck in its “fins” before it decides to barge into the hold.

      2. Joneleth says:

        Magic eyeball thingy has enough firepower to punch through the armored hull of a frigate but can’t tear the ship apart once it’s inside? What. The. Hell?!

        1. Luhrsen says:

          Of course not. Shepards “Awesomeness Field”(tm) dampened its power.

  6. Jekyll says:

    “Jacob, I salute you”
    Best. Line. Ever.

  7. ehlijen says:

    As to why joker’s rips seem to heal: maybe he has that fallout trait where he suffers worse from drugs but recovers quicker, only it applies to bones?

    1. Chris B Chikin says:

      The appearance of the words “drugs,” “Fallout” and “Joker” just made me imagine him as Reginald Cuftbert’s great, great grandson or something.

      “Regina, meet your cousin!”

  8. Daemian Lucifer says:

    The relay being red isnt that much of a problem though.You can let it slide.There is something much,much worse:
    Why is there debris here anyway?We established already that no one returns because the relay opens in the center of the universe,and normally relays have drift that is higher than the safe zone.So there should be just a small tunnel of empty space,and huge blackness around it.Its one thing when you make a story bad,cliched or illogical,but when you cant keep it internally consistent,you truly fail as a writer.

    Oh,and why is joker the one who is shooting in the end?I mean it does make sense if everyone else dies,but if you send someone back with the rescued crew,shouldnt they be shooting?You know,because they have combat training,while joker is your pilot and a cripple.Even worse,a cripple with broken ribs.

    Oh,I forgot what a pushover oculus is on normal.It was at least fun to watch it die in one try for a change.

    And you totally shouldve romanced garrus.But,you still have the chance to sex up kelly if you rescue her.Which still is nice.

    Oh,and there goes the freaky lizard guy.I wonder if his last words were “Why doesnt anyone want to talk to me?At least you understand me desk.”

    1. Jarenth says:

      Well, I can think of two explanations for the debris field:

      Either: The ships that went through the Omega-4 Relay and got lucky with their drift just got instakilled by the Collector Base.

      Or: The level designers made this sweet interstellar debris field and they had no other place to put it.

      1. Daemian Lucifer says:

        “The ships that went through the Omega-4 Relay and got lucky with their drift just got instakilled by the Collector Base.”

        And they apparently never bothered with the cleaning,nor does their ship disturb the debris when it passes.So Ill go with that other option.Which still makes this part an absolute fail.

    2. Ringwraith says:

      The description for the relay does actually state that the relay has tons of warnings all over it so people don’t go into it.

    3. Klay F. says:

      Alas, for almost nobody here is familiar with interstellar astronomy. Firstly, to Shamus and Josh complaining about being able to see a black-hole. The writers here were actually very careful never to mention the word “black-hole”. They do however, mention an “accretion disc” An accretion disc is formed by matter (usually gas) orbiting and spiraling into a central body. Accretion discs do actually exist. They mention something along the lines that the debris field is at the edge of said accretion disc. It is not that implausible that any ship coming through the Omega Relay at anything other than the optimal angle would get ripped to shreds by the gravity waves here. As to why we can see the black hole at all, you aren’t seeing the actual black hole, you are seeing the event horizon (more accurately the only reason you are seeing the Event Horizon at all is because you are seeing where the gas closest to it is falling in and disappearing. The difference in where you can see the gas, and where you cannot is what is defining the boundaries of the Event Horizon).

      The fact remains that most of what I just said regarding the Event Horizon is pure conjecture, since nobody really knows. It comes down to an artist imagination (and honestly all we have ever had is artist’s conceptions).

      Of course, this is all laying aside the fact that the Black Hole at the center of the Milky Way does NOT have an accretion disc, AND it has a mass of 4.1 MILLION solar masses, so that you would be dead from every atom in your body being pulled apart before you got anywhere even RESEMBLING close enough to see the Event Horizon.

      Okay I’ve ranted about things only I care about long enough. All I’m trying to say is that you are bitching this scene out for the wrong reasons, there are plenty of perfectly good other valid reasons to bitch it out.

      1. Alex says:

        “Of course, this is all laying aside the fact that the Black Hole at the center of the Milky Way does NOT have an accretion disc, AND it has a mass of 4.1 MILLION solar masses, so that you would be dead from every atom in your body being pulled apart before you got anywhere even RESEMBLING close enough to see the Event Horizon.”

        It would actually be easier to get close enough to such a large black hole to see it, because the event horizon gets bigger but the tidal stresses do not.

      2. Daemian Lucifer says:

        “Okay I've ranted about things only I care about long enough. All I'm trying to say is that you are bitching this scene out for the wrong reasons, there are plenty of perfectly good other valid reasons to bitch it out.”

        I never said anything about the accretion disc and that it is possible to observe a black hole in certain ways.And that it is possible for a ship to get torn apart by a black hole before they reach the event horizon.

        However,what was established by the game is that collector base is so close to the center of the universe that it can in no way survive unshielded.So why is this debris here,in the shielded path?And why is some of it ancient?Either it was torn apart outside of the shielded path,and then pulled inside it,or they ended up inside and got blown up by someone.But if the first is true,then what is to stop a star that is being pulled by the black hole to pass through the shielded path and obliterate everything inside it?So it means that the debris is from ships that ended up inside the shielded path by accident,and got blown up.

        However,why would that debris be left inside?If nothing else,the collector ship would push it aside whenever they pass through.Not to mention that collectors have existed for only one cycle,and for some of the ships to look ancient,theyd have to come from other cycles,so who lived here?It was already established that reapers keep their inventions for a long,long time(keepers were there for at least two cycles),so why would they replace anyone in the base?

        The debris field is inconsistent with the story itself,which is something only bad writers do.Inconsistency with the real world can always be overlooked,but inconsistency with what youve already established earlier in the story can not.That is why I consider this to be one of the biggest problems in this particular scene.

    4. Specktre says:

      “The relay being red isnt that much of a problem though.You can let it slide.”

      If you read the Omega 4 Relay description, it actually explains that relays light up red as a warning to show when it’s not safe to pass through.

  9. James says:

    i’d hate to see the youtube page of flame war that might be happening right now.
    Get well soon mumbles

  10. Grag says:

    You should have romanced Joker! They could have done it offscreen and we just hear a bunch of cracking noises.

    1. Daemian Lucifer says:

      He is a taken man.His heart belongs to a machine.Though you are partially machine yourself,you still lack that sexy metallic voice(for the record,I do like edis voice).

      1. ehlijen says:

        Plus see further above for possible cousin status :P

    2. Integer Man says:

      Or Mordin, EDI, or Legion.

      1. Grag says:

        Romancing a robot isn’t normal, but with Geth it is.

        Geth: Not even once.

        1. Smirker says:

          The Problem with doing a Geth is that not only can not do it with just one (one platform sure, but there are so many per platform/frame); but within microseconds (if not faster) the entire geth race has ‘biblical’ experience with you. bad enough if they just TOLD each other about it, but they actually share the experience!

      2. Jekyll says:

        Gah! The refrence to robo sex just made me remember Fisto….I need a shower now.

        1. X2-Eliah says:

          Ah,yes. I kinda love Obsidian for putting in the option fr you to actually assume the position. Few games go that far *g*

          1. Chuck says:

            At the same time, I am very glad they did not make us have to go through that… test.

            so more props for Obsidian.

        2. ehlijen says:

          Kit Fisto is a robot? Wha?

  11. Klay F. says:

    Man, if TIM had actually come along I would;ve SO picked him to “hold the line”.

  12. Halfling says:

    I think Spoiler Warning went the way of my first play through.

    I put an unloyal character in the vents and Garrus was leading the fire team. Who died? Garrus. Who I had romanced on that particular play-through. I think I ended up having to go back like an hour in my manual saves because I wanted him to live.

    Also if both Miranda and Jacob are unloyal when the team holds the line both die. In my experience. Also Miranda never survives holding the line if you romance her. At least in my experience anyway.

    Unless if they buffed her survivability in a patch or something. Bioware would do something like that.

    1. Hitch says:

      “Also, Miranda never survives holding the line if you romance her.”

      No! Not even to make sure she dies. ;-)

      1. Halfling says:

        And for this weakness you shalt suffer her in ME3!!!

        1. Hitch says:

          As if. Even if you do kill her off and import the save, I’m sure they’ll bring her back by having her re-built even more perfect than before… where “perfect” means irritating and obnoxious.

          1. Alexander The 1st says:

            Space Obi-Wan?

            I could totally see her when holding the line:

            Miranda: “If you strike me down, I shall become more perfect than you can ever imagine!”

            1. ehlijen says:

              I love your use of ‘more perfect’. Really catches how she’s just clueless :D

              1. Alexander The 1st says:

                Well, the original quote is “more powerful”, and “perfecter” isn’t a word, but yeah, the idea that a “perfect” character gets potential character development and becomes “more perfect” is just so absurd that I couldn’t pass it up.

  13. Deadpool says:

    Btw, I think it’s going to take 3 hours to GET to the relay, not to cross it. Otherwise, it’d be silly.

    Notice, that I can imagine it taking some time. I don’t know the “science” behind the Mass Effect relays, but if it propels you at X lightyears per hour (where X is a REALY high number) and Ilos is X/120 lightyears away from the Citadel, while the Collector base is 3X lightyears away from the Omega relay… It all works out.

    Problem is, no one has ever come back from the Omega relay, no one knows where it leads to, so for Miranda to have ANY idea how long the trip is going to take would be stupid indeed…

  14. Raygereio says:

    Hey, guys want hear something fun? I got Mass Effect Retribution (the novel that takes place directly after ME2) and read it. Because I hate myself, you see.
    Remember how you put Anderson on the council and made Udina his wipping boy? Guess what just got retconned!

    A short synopsis:
    Anderson decided on not much more then a whim that cerberus must be eradicated right now. So he buddies up with the Turian Councilor and created a Turian/Anderson initiative to destroy Cerby forever. This pisses off the Alliance – lord knows why, you’d think they be happy with Cerberus gone – and Anderson is kicked out. He then decides to give the counil the middle-finger for no reason whatsover, probably because he has so much faith in Udina’s diplomacy skills as he’s taking over in his place.

    Anderson then goes on a galaxy wide Cerberus hunting spree, beating up operatives with his bare hands – this all before he even finds out they did bad stuff. Anderson does find evidence of Cerberus being a bunch of evil-for-the-lulz-idiots and because of this, near the end of the book he declares he’ll hunt down all Cerberus people and give every singe one of then the Anderson-left-special, including Shepard. Because you know, no one told TIMmy to fuck off at the end of ME2.

    Fuck you, Drew Karpyshyn. Fuck you. And fuck everyone whoever wrote a good review of this piece of dren. There’s no doubt in my mind ME3 will have more then decent gameplay, but there’s no chance in hell the writing will not make you want to stab yourself in eye with a broken bottle of beer, one you just busted over your own head because the thought of experiencing this wonderfull masterpiece of a story while not continually supplied with sweet, intoxicating, mind-numbing alcohol will drive you insane.

    Also; not strictly ME related, but still worth sharing:
    Yeah, I’m just going to cry for a bit now.

    1. X2-Eliah says:

      So they retconned the udina/anderson choice AND the give over collector base/tell TIM to screw off ?

      1. Vect says:

        In most other Expanded Universe stuff, Udina is always the councilor. In one of the comics, he’s the one that got Bailey his job and Bailey got his job when he killed Pallin.

        1. daveNYC says:

          Udina as councilor makes no sense. The guy was a complete asshole in ME1 and I can’t quite imagine what a player would have been thinking if they put him on the council over Anderson.

          1. Josh R says:

            i’m guessing the thinking there goes along the lines of udina being more suited to ambassadorial work and andersen having little aptitude for it.

      2. James says:

        If i remember the book right they don’t say if the base lived only that they found tech (maby form ruins), i was a bit miffed when the Anderson Udina decision was retconned, oh and the council is alive FYI.
        I actually accepted he live the council, he did it to take down Cerberus and for the women whos name escapes me.
        He didn’t take the idea to alliance ‘cus Cerby has spies there, the Turians and Anderson do alot of damage to Cerby they hit several facilities and spies all at the same time, Anderson only kills one man i think maby 2, and thats Grayson and that Baterian guard of Aria’s.

        Greyson was implanted with Reaper tech like Saren was, Cerby wanted to know what happens when infected it goes bad rampage death carnage.

        1. Veloxyll says:

          So the EU doesn’t have to adhere to canon whaaaa.
          Dear Bioware: Tie ins are nice but maybe have them actually match up with the current story?

    2. Halfling says:

      ….Why why did you just have to show me that screenshot?

      I think I died a little inside.


    3. Daemian Lucifer says:

      This puzzles me:What is the point of making a novel for a non-linear game?Especially if it is canon.Basically what you are saying to most fans of the game(because who else would read a novel based on a game)that they did it wrong and their actions dont matter.

      If you want to tell just a single story,then make a linear game.Half life is a great game,and it has a great story,despite it being linear as hell,and having one of the most chewed over plots ever.So whats wrong with that?You arent improving your story just by making it a non-linear one.

      Or,if you really want to make a novel based on a non-linear game,make a prequel,or write a story that only tangentially touches the events in the game.Use just those things that are fixed,dont go and retcon what half the players did.

      1. Klay F. says:

        Welcome to the world of Star Wars fans. Lucas retcons his material with all the subtlety of a rapist clown.

        1. Daemian Lucifer says:

          Im not a fan of star wars(disregarding the kotor games,that is),but even I hate the guy for doing that.

      2. James says:

        we could assume that the Books/Comic and start you get if you didnt play the previous games is the “stock cannon” and you can have your own cannon, your story? or is that too much of a clever marketing idea?

    4. Irridium says:

      So that explains why Bioware Romances are usually hilariously bad. And why all my friends want to have hot, spicy sex with me after 3 conversations.

      1. Halfling says:

        Hey at least Dragon Age II sort of fixed it. I am pretty sure you know people for at least three years before any ‘romancing’ occurs.

        1. Raygereio says:

          Clearly you haven’t played DA2 yet. Trust me, the romances are just as stupid and laugh/groan-inducing as ever.

          1. Halfling says:

            Hey I said sort of fixed it. The romances are still grown worthy. But at least these are people you have known for more then 20 minutes. At least now it is easier to pretend some non-grown worthy stuff happened off screen.

      2. El Quia says:

        Yes, one of the stuff that REALLY got on my nerves, more than every other thing this game does WRONG is the fact that it seems that it’s impossible for a man to treat a woman right without the woman instantly falling in love and wanting to jump your bones. If that were the case, then a lot of dorky “hot girl best friends” would be having awesome sex at this very moment… and we know that’s not true :p

        I don’t know for the inverse situation (female shepard with male companions) because I haven’t played with femshep yet, but seriously, I was just being nice! or decent! or just civil! How come that congratulating someone for a job well done is enough to make the other person get the hots for you? I think that even porn movie pizza boy/housewive sex scene is more realistic! :P At least, there’s no pretension of love being involved :p (and no, I don’t think it’s realistic, it’s a freaking joke :P)

        Joking aside, no, treating someone right doesn’t instantly mean deep, true love with awesome spicy sex involved. It just mean being friendly. And sometimes not even that.

    5. Jekyll says:

      In response to the pic…well just imagining me doing the Luke Skywalker noooooo thing, even with the wierd beaver face. And to the four of you who were there at the end of Josh’s jaunt through Dead Space I mentioned that that terrible excuse of a plot got its own book….and it’s a prequel…

  15. Skeletor says:

    “Jacob, I salute you.”

    Actually the question to why the omega 4 relay or whatever looks different then the others works for a lot of games. They try to show you the difference between the normal relay or whatever even if it makes no sense.

    1. Halfling says:

      Because Bioware wanted to make it look more threatening.

      If I were to lamp shade it myself I would say that relays that lead to dangerous areas can mark themselves. So basically that is what the caution sign looks like. :P

      1. Integer Man says:

        “There be dragons”

      2. James says:

        Maby it’s what a collector built Relay looks like? i mean why would the reapers built a relay to the center of the galaxy, (oh FYI 90% of relays were built by the Reapers), so maby the power or tech needed to go to the center of the galaxy makes it look mad.

        oh and there might be a Supermassive Black Hole at the center of the galaxy which i think Ruts was alluding to.

        From Wikipedia (sorry)
        A supermassive black hole is the largest type of black hole in a galaxy, in the order of hundreds of thousands to billions of solar masses. Most, and possibly all galaxies, including the Milky Way, are believed to contain supermassive black holes at their centers.

        my old Physics teacher said this could be true and he was dammed clever.

        1. Daemian Lucifer says:

          Nope,reapers made that one.It predate the collectors.That line about ancient debris,though stupid,does tell you that ships were going through here for a few cycles now.And collectors are only one cycle old.

          Not to mention that collectors only have some advanced technology,but tech needed to make a safe pocket in the center of the galaxy is probably of reaper origin,and I doubt theyd share it even with their tools.As to what was there before the collectors,eh..Maybe they made this base in the beginning,and decided later to move outside the galaxy,but the base remained.

          1. RejjeN says:

            I don’t think there’s enough space there for all the Reapers, even if there were being in “off” mode while the station failed randomly (it could happen) doesn’t seem like a very good idea xD

            Anyway, I like how Shamus was basically saying “I’m right and if anyone doesn’t agree with me they are stupid and a fanboy”, yes I agree that there’s massive holes in the plot, but a lot of the things you guys have been complaining about have explanations in game, some happening RIGHT as you complain about them if I’m not mistaken… Doesn’t make the plot any more sensible though.

            1. Daemian Lucifer says:

              “I don't think there's enough space there for all the Reapers,”

              As they are now.What if they started out like the geth,and this is where they hid back then,before they made the first huge ship?

              And we know that their tech lasts for eons.Just look at the citadel.

              1. Alexander The 1st says:

                To pull in Klendragon, perhaps they did until they were discovered and fought against with the mass relay?

              2. RejjeN says:

                Well yes, but the Citadel isn’t surrounded by black holes and exploding suns.

  16. lurkey says:

    You should have put Jack as the team leader, if only to wipe that smirk off Miranda’s face for a moment. Seriously, why does she always act as Shep’s second in command?

    I remember having a crush on Candalore, too. Well, er, not I, but my Revan, who looked a bit like Vasquez of “Aliens”, did. I couldn’t imagine someone like Vasquez fall for a Carth type. Canderous, on the other hand…I still remember those tales of planetary scale mayhem and carnage he used to tell…awww. He’s so like Wrex, just without backup organs.

    1. Sydney says:

      Seriously, why does she always act as Shep's second in command?

      Because she is.

      1. lurkey says:

        Not in my bloody game.

      2. Daemian Lucifer says:

        I wouldnt let her take care of my fish,let alone my ship and crew.

        1. Sydney says:

          You’re not in charge. TIM is; he says Miranda’s second-in-command, so she is.

          Just saying.

          1. Daemian Lucifer says:

            Of course he is in charge.Thats why you can collect sensitive data about cerberus and do with them as you please,and in the end take the ship,along with its super advanced ai,for yourself.

    2. krellen says:

      I’m glad I’m not the only one that knows Revan was a woman.

      1. Raygereio says:

        But canon says he a male. With black hair and…
        *gunshot noice*

        Oh, I’m sorry. No idea how the Star Wars fanboy got in.

      2. Daemian Lucifer says:

        Well of course.What else could she have been?

        1. ehlijen says:

          Revan was a wookie of indeterminate gender :P

          1. Daemian Lucifer says:

            That is blasphemy!That is madness!

            1. ehlijen says:

              This. Is. The. Teddy bear picnic!

      3. Slothful says:

        Revan schmeven, she said “Mandalore,” so that means that she wanted to romance him in the second game as the exile!

        1. krellen says:

          Also a woman.

    3. Johan says:

      Also doesn’t he say “I’ve been fighting for 40 of your years.” He’s as old as the hills, probably been fighting since before Revan was born. AWKWARD

      1. Bret says:

        Wrex, meanwhile, has been fighting since the middle ages.

        Wrex is the best.

        1. ehlijen says:

          Only surpassed by Grunt and his wonderful pun and love for action figures and sharks :D

          1. Specktre says:

            LOL! Really? I don’t think I ever got Grunt to tell me that, how does that come about?

            1. Skalpadda says:

              You find it out in the Lair of the Shadow Broker DLC.

  17. RTBones says:

    Mumbles – the sure-fire way to clear up a cold? Whiskey. The water of life.

    * slides the bottle of Jameson across the bar *

    Get well soon.

    1. SomeUnregPunk says:

      Can you see anyone going to work sick with a cold, drunk and not getting fired over it?

      1. Robyrt says:

        As a programmer, I could probably do that every Thursday and no one would know.

    2. Lalaland says:

      Good call on the Jameson’s! There’s a reason the Gaelic for Whisky is ‘Uisce Beatha’ (pronounced ishka bya-ha) meaning ‘Water of Life’.

    3. Mumbles says:

      RT, you are a man after my heart.

  18. Alexander The 1st says:

    In regards to your Youtube description:

    They had to show how it was a suicide mission. Collectors? Nah, we’ve ripped through millions of them. That ship? We’ve survived it a few times now, even getting so confident to charge right down its barrel.

    But, you’re stuck with Miranda on a trip with no definitive return point. And she can’t die until the end. “Others (Miranda’s exes) say its a suicide mission.”


    Also, if you could get Tim with you, I’d replace his sun video with a rick roll instead of lolcats.

  19. dovius says:

    Well, it’s entirely possible that the giant bright thing is the Accretion Disk of matter that gathers around a black hole.
    With the size of the black hole at the centre of the Milky Way (it’s called ‘supermassive’ for a reason) it’s possible that said accretion disk contains small stars or very hot/flashy matter.
    or the designers goofed up because it looks awesome, could be that too *shrugs*

    1. daveNYC says:

      Things get all hot and bothered as they get closer to the event horizon of a black hole. That’s how they keep detecting those jets of x-rays coming off the things. I suspect that an accretion disk would probably have some glow to it in real life.

      1. dovius says:

        or, if they’re far enough, it might be stars going supernova.
        I’d also like to point out that there’s a black center clearly visible at some points. there ya go folks, there be a black hole

      2. Klay F. says:

        Yes, Accretion Discs (ITS DISC!!! WITH A C!!!) have been spotted in real life. The only problem is that there is NO accretion disc around the Black Hole in the center of the Milky Way, there are only stars orbiting very close and very fast.

        1. Fnord says:

          Is it ever actually said that it’s the Milky Way’s central black hole? Or, for that matter, a black hole at all?

        2. dovius says:

          actually, couldn’t the Milky Way itself be considered the Accretion Disc (Knew I was misspelling it somehow! Damn my lack of an astrophysics doctorate!) of the black hole in it’s center?

  20. Exasperation says:

    While I laughed at a bunch of the things you guys said, my favorite thing from this episode is when you take the time to loot a crate during a desperate battle for survival, in the middle of a suicide mission, in the cargo bay of your own ship and Cerberus actually pays you to do so.

    1. ehlijen says:

      It’s the moderate lifitng surcharge Shepard puts on everything :)

      1. Alexander The 1st says:

        I thought it was because we’re about to go rogue, that TIM isn’t paying attention to what you sell to them anymore.

        “Oh, some medi-gel? Cool, here’s 1000 credits Shepard.”

        Shepard: “…Really? Did we just go rogue on him by sending him our own material for payment?”

  21. Slothful says:

    You know I never saw this showdown with the collector ship coming. After a while, I just sorta thought that I was pimping my ship just for the hell of it. I was also hoping to show up to the migrant fleet and be all, “hey, check out my ship” but no.

    Also, you murderers! Why didn’t you get the super mega death lasers? That means that all of Garrus’s calibrations were for nothing.

    To be honest, Thane’s problem in this game was that he seemed really neat, but they never did anything with him. I liked his character design, I liked his voice, I liked the backstory of his species, but god damn it, he ended up being BORING. He was on the cover of the game! You’d think they’d throw him a bone.

    1. X2-Eliah says:

      He was just placed in far too late. Had he been one of the very early findable characters, he’d get more screen time, but he’s up against tali, legion, and all of the first row as well (garrus, mordin) – there’s just no spot for him.

      Shame, because he is a really good character, all in all – best right after Mordin of the new ones, imo.

      1. Slothful says:

        And of course, he’s got no real chance for the next game because of that whole “dying” thing.

  22. MikeShikle says:

    Mandalore was great and all, but only because HK didnt put out!

    1. Mari says:

      You are a sick man.

      Also, for the record I/my Revan would have totally tapped Canderous. My greatest delight in the game was taking the romance with Carth so far and then breaking it forever. Like a galaxy-conquering Sith Lord would ever have the hots for a whiny wangst-machine like that.

      1. ehlijen says:

        But the only way to kill carth is not to break it off and let him try to ‘rescue’ you after the showdown…

      2. Mumbles says:

        Carth has a sexy voice, though. I don’t remember a word he said, just that it sounded hot.

    2. Noble Bear says:

      Nothing like a good hate f*** witha machine built to perform. ;)

  23. Noble Bear says:


    In space, no one can hear you NERD RAGE. ;)

    1. Slothful says:

      I seen things far, far, worse than flamewars.

  24. sebcw1204 says:

    “bullshit shielding that keeps air in but doesn’t keep robots out” actually, look up plasma shield. i watched a special on star wars “tech” that suggested that a shielding of plasma would be a good lightweight alternative to windows. you could make them large, solid objects could pass through (if they could survive the temperature), and gas could not.

    1. Klay F. says:

      Its seriously one of the oldest tropes in sci-fi history. I didn’t really get the bitching about in the video, especially when there are plenty of valid things they could have bitched about instead.

      1. Daemian Lucifer says:

        Plus,we also saw it in the intro when joker safely sits inside an air pocket while the rest of the ship is torn to shreds.Its just a different form of a kinetic barrier.

  25. Ouchies81 says:

    Some reading on the accretion disk around that black hole.


  26. Nighty says:

    Not true. I gave a dis-loyal Miranda the biotic barrier job and she died at the end. Just as planned!

  27. BeamSplashX says:

    8:29 = Shepherd peeks at Miranda’s cleavage

    If it was something else, I’d like to know. That was pretty distracting for a split-second moment.

  28. SpammyV says:

    Thoughts during the episode I would leave as Viddler comments:


    I think the problem with the Collector laser is that it only fires forward but it’s standing between you and where you need to go. Doesn’t excuse the other times it’s shown up.

    Jacob, you salute Shepard when no one else does, but you also disagree with Miranda. Shed your mortal coil and salute in the stars, shoulder.

    Also: WHY IS A STEALTH SHIP IN THE MASS EFFECT UNIVERSE NOT ACTUALLY STEALTH?! Why couldn’t we fly in under the radar?! Oh right, because in Mass Effect having a stealth ship is like having a car with a muffler. What’s the point of having a elite stealth ship if it can’t stealth in? Why didn’t we go to Tim and ask him to build us a battleship with armor and shields enough to ignore all the debris? Or rent one from the Council. They have to owe us. Anderson, at least. Or more than one battleship. Hell, if we have the Reaper IFF why don’t we build more and come in with a fleet? Is there a time limit I’m missing? Doesn’t seem like there’s been one for the rest of the game.

    1. Daemian Lucifer says:

      Its been established it the very opening movie that the collectors can detect even a cloaked ship.So at least that one has an explanation.And at least this time normandy does use its stealth systems,even if it just for one mission.

      1. ehlijen says:

        But if the Normandy 2 is built to take on the mysterious abductors (who TIM already suspects to be collectors…) why not either forget about the super expensive nonsense system that didn’t help the Normandy 1 or improve on it?

        Hey let’s spend another few billion on something we know didn’t work the first time!

        1. Daemian Lucifer says:

          Well we didnt get anyone who is expert in stealth to improve it for us,like we did with weapons,hull and kinetic barriers.

          1. SomeUnregPunk says:

            It was stated that the stealth system only decreased their heat output so that space radar doesn’t pick them up as a ship their size.

            I just assumed that this doesn’t work with the reapers since they just man a collector on every square inch of their ship with excellent eyesight.

    2. Simon Buchan says:

      It’s also established in the opening movie that the Collector ship *can*, in fact, fire at nearly 90 degree angles. That huge glowy hole on the front is just the inside of the ship, not the weapon, even though it is exactly the same color (???).

    3. Fnord says:

      RE: Stealth. You’re RIGHT THERE. They can look out the windows and SEE you. As Joker says, right before Legion’s loyalty mission, the stealth system doesn’t actually make you invisible.

      The advantage of stealth is that you’re not a hot object silhouetted against interstellar space, visible from half a solar system away. Which is why you’re able to sneak into the Heretic Station (and Ilos, in 1) and possibly why the Collector ship doesn’t until you’re already almost at the station, instead of as soon as you enter the system.

      1. Alexander The 1st says:

        Also, it actually sounds counter-intuitive to the space you’re in – you’d expect with the sun-black hole-thing that they wanted this place to be very, very warm.

        So that’s why you probably got detected. The only cool thing on the radar.

  29. Mediocre Man says:

    I was looking at the Spoiler Warning logo pic, and a sudden thought occurred to me:

    What is Shamus doing behind that couch, and why is he making that face?

    Spoiler Warning and Star Wars, coincidence? I think not!

  30. Veloxyll says:

    The Normandy 1 totally had a drive core. I think Tali mentions it’s 3 times the size of what a ship as small as the Normandy would normally have.

    Also, what the hell is the point of Garrus’s upgrade? Joker still manages to get us caught in the blast of the Collector ship with or without it.

    1. M says:


      1. Integer Man says:

        Then what’s the point of recruiting so many redshirts?

    2. daveNYC says:

      Oh it’s even better if you get Garrus’s upgrade. With the regular cannons, you have to get in close to hurt the Collectors. With the sexy new thanix cannon, you can blow them to hell from a safe distance, but Sheppard actually orders Joker to get in close for the final shot. It’s about as stupid a move as the whole ‘everyone on the shuttle so the Collectors can attack’ move, but it’s over much quicker so you might not pick up on it.

    3. Slothful says:

      You gotta pimp your ship, or the Quarians are gonna laugh you outta the Migrant Fleet!

      ‘Sides, Garrus told you to. He knows what you should do. He spent ages calibrating his decision perfectly.

  31. Zaxares says:

    Three hours to go through a relay: I’m assuming that the writers took some creative liberty with the whole Normandy zooming around on the galaxy map. It’s probably not an indication of the Normandy’s ACTUAL position, but some sort of VR simulation that lets Shepard pick a destination, and then the Normandy actually travels there. Even FTL travel is not instantaneous.

    Overcharging the Core: Presumably using the IFF requires greater electrical and energy output from the ship travelling in order to arrive at a more precise destination when travelling through the relay. This kind of makes sense, because the mass relays don’t seem to have any obvious external power source and never seem to need refueling. Therefore, it must stand to reason that the bulk of the energy being provided for the journey is coming from the ships travelling through the relays themselves.

    Oh, and Josh? The Mako DID have a mass effect core. It even says so in the ME1 Codex entry! So there! ;)

    Also, that thing in the background is NOT a sun. It’s a super-massive black hole that forms the gravitational anchor for the Milky Way. Despite appearances, it’s probably still millions of kilometers away from where the player is during this cutscene. (Aaand of course, Josh has to mention it and render this point moot. :P) I WILL grant that black holes should not really look like that. At least, not to the naked eye. Black holes ARE throwing out immense amounts of radiation, but they can only be detected with specialised equipment and wouldn’t be visible to a casual observer. I’m chalking this one up to “it looks cool” decisions by artists.

    Jack Dying: No, Jack dies at the very first blast from the Oculus, the part where Miranda says “As long as the new plating holds.” If you didn’t research the Silaris Armor upgrade, that’s where Jack dies.

    Debris Field: Given how EDI is constantly saying “Kinetic Barriers now at X%”, I’m assuming that the Normandy is also having massive amounts of collisions with objects, but it has much more powerful kinetic barriers than the Oculi (not to mention thicker hull plating), which is why it seems to be taking less damage.

    Also, if you didn’t research the Cyclonic Shields tech given to you by Tali, then during this scene Kasumi/Legion/Tali will die, in that order of preference.

    Hull Breaches: I agree that this part has a logical inconsistency. Kinetic barriers traditionally do not affect things like gases, fire, chemical weapons etc. because the individual molecules are far too small to be affected by the barriers. Supposedly there are mass-effect fields that is keeping the atmosphere in, but it doesn’t mesh up with how the rest of the lore describes mass-effect fields as working.

    It doesn’t stop the Oculus because most kinetic barriers are only designed to stop objects within a certain mass range. Anything that is too small (the afore-mentioned gas and chemical molercules) or too large (like the Oculus or a starship) won’t be affected by the kinetic barrier.

    Thane’s Death: Somewhere, I’m sure a Thane fan-girl is screaming her heart out right now. You fiends! :P

    Jacob for the Tech Specialist: I always send a PROPER tech expert to do this, but I have to say, I’m ALWAYS tempted to pick Jacob because, as you guys point out, he VOLUNTEERED. There was a very high chance that whoever went into the maintenance tunnel wasn’t going to come out alive, and since neither Kasumi or Legion volunteered (and no way in HELL I’m sending Tali in there), it feels the most ‘right’ to pick a volunteer for the job.

    Final Speech: I agree. This was not one of Bioware’s finer speech-writing moments. :P That said, I DID like the way the music swells and Jacob cracks his knuckles meaningfully. (If Jack is killed on the mission, Samara/Morinth also does the whole cool “biotic glow/hum” thing.)

    1. Chris B Chikin says:

      I was relieved that Jacob volunteered. During my first playthrough I wasn’t sure how the system for who died worked, and I liked all the tech experts (Mordin, Legion, Tali) too much to send them on what everyone was describing as a death sentence. Thank you Jacob, for letting me make a guilt-free decision.

    2. Josh R says:

      On my first playthrough (blind run) I got every upgrade and made everyone loyal and planned to not lose anyone (which of course never happened because in the time i spent getting everyone loyal all my crew had died)

      but I thought, tali – by far the best placed to walk through a vent – her tech abilities unmatched and her slender figure well able to fit into small spaces – this is of course assuming that the vent would be, y’know, vent sized. Or maybe I just wasn’t too attached as I find tali a bit pathetic.

      I picked Samara for the biotic mission – as she was supposed to be this god of biotics, and by both of those choices managed to get no one to die.

      I picked Garrus for team leader, due to his previous experience leading a team and the fact that he’s good, and that insured he survived.

      on my second playthrough I picked grunt as team captain, thane as biotic and garrus as tech specialist. and got screwed over in all cases.

      1. Alexander The 1st says:

        Yeah…I followed the wiki for this.

        Though I look forward to watching Miranda dying this time. I can so see you guys re-loading this mission a few times solely to get her to die. Over and over and over again… :p

      2. Integer Man says:

        The game should reward you with a comical death if you pick people who are horrible for the job you selected them for.


        Grunt as Tech Specialist
        Mordin as Team Leader
        Miranda as Biotic
        Shamus as Bioware Cheerleader
        Mumbles as Batman

        (just kidding – I’d never advocate killing Mordin)

        1. Daemian Lucifer says:

          I think you made a mistake there.You dont get offered grunt when you are picking the tech specialist.Though I guess it would be just as hilarious if you put Rutskarn in that position.

          1. Integer Man says:

            Yeah, caught me. I forgot the choices.

            Because of the silly Krogan Poetry joke, I can’t look at the Krogan race without thinking of the Vogon Constructor Fleet or their stereotypical tendencies toward smashing things. I think Grunt’s solution would be to smash the electronics in with his skull (or with Jack’s skull).

    3. bit says:

      I claim the spot of that Thane fangirl/boy. I loved Thane, Josh, why’d you gotta go do that? :'(

  32. cavalier says:

    At 7:51, during the fight in the hold, Regina ‘recovered salvage’ from her own ship! How does that work? I know it’s a minor thing but it just blows my mind. Many games let you take things from other people but this might be the first game that lets you steal from yourself.

  33. Miral says:

    This has already been pointed out a couple of times, but the “three hours” thing is the trip *to* the relay, not through it. All the romance stuff / chat with TIM occurs before you arrive at the relay.

    Space is big. Even with mass relays.

    (Of course it was undermined a little bit in my playthrough since my previous mission was also in the Omega system, but it would have worked otherwise. All the interaction with the map is just course plotting, not actual travel.)

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